…Deputy Gino Kenny: I thank everybody for coming in today. Their contributions have been very insightful. I do not have a particular question but I will raise an issue. I am not sure anyone here is qualified to provide an answer but I will give my own thoughts on the issue. It relates to a report issued this week by the College of Psychiatrists of Ireland on cannabis use among young people. What I am really looking for is the witnesses' observations from working with young people. Have they noticed an increase in the use of cannabis? The College of Psychiatrists of Ireland made a number of quite concerning observations. Some of these are not new but, in the college's words "Cannabis represents the gravest threat to the mental health of young people in Ireland". I have my own thoughts on that. We are getting into a wider debate around regulation, decriminalisation and so forth. This situation is a consequence of driving it underground. Is cannabis used widely among young people? A minority use cannabis, while a minority of that minority use it on a daily basis, which is not good for anybody's general well-being. An additional dimension to this is that some young people will use drugs to escape, just as some use alcohol. They use it to escape from many things in their lives. Obviously, the pandemic has not helped in any way. 

It is useful that the psychiatrists have brought this issue to public attention because it is a public health issue. Again, I have my own views with regard to how to tackle drug use and drug abuse, particularly among young people. The system we have at the moment alienates people and does not work. Criminalising people just does not work. I would like the views or observations of the witnesses on the particular critique of these psychiatrists with regard to cannabis use among young people. Is it on the increase? Is it decreasing? Perhaps the witnesses will share their thoughts. 

Mr. Ian Power: I thank the Deputy for the question because it is an important debate to have. Any research or evidence we have seen shows that there is an increase in cannabis use among young people and an increase in the regularity with which some young people are using cannabis. As the Deputy says, young people use alcohol and drugs as a coping mechanism and as a social lubricant. We need to support young people to develop healthier coping mechanisms. That should be part of the education process. In respect of this week's debate, we need a balanced and calm conversation. I do not agree with the assessment of the College of Psychiatrists of Ireland. I have great respect for people like Professor Mary Cannon who has done an enormous amount of research in this space. It shows the stronger potency of some of the cannabis used by young people, and of cannabis generally. The results also depend on the young people themselves. Some are going to be more vulnerable to things like psychosis and other really damaging mental health effects. 

It is not fair to dismiss the concerns out of hand. There is significant evidence showing that some young people are being significantly adversely affected. These are mental health disorders. They are things that have the potential to impact young people for quite some time. We should not, however, come at it from an alarmist perspective. We should have a reasonable, balanced and calm conversation about the issue. Prohibition does not work. We know that. We also know that telling young people not to do something is a sure-fire way to switch them off from the conversation. We also believe that we should not criminalise young people any further than they already are being criminalised. The system in Ireland is very well established. We try to divert young people from engagement with drugs as much as is possible because we know that is best and creates the best outcomes for young people. We know that young people's brains continue to develop until at least 25 years of age, if not beyond. Their concept of risk is different and develops over time. We have a great deal of respect for the college and for the researchers I have mentioned. 

While we are concerned about the impact on young people and the reasons they are turning to and using cannabis, we hope for and encourage a more calm and balanced conversation and debate about the issue. I thank the Deputy. 

Ms Louise Monaghan: I would reiterate everything Mr. Power has said. Our experience is that youth workers are reporting an increased level of use. There is more normalisation and cannabis use has become much more acceptable. I absolutely concur with everything Mr. Power said in that we need to move away from the alarmist approach to one involving more information and research. We must approach this in a measured way. 

Chairman: On that issue, is there any information that the representatives could send us? It would be very helpful. 

Mr. Ian Power: Absolutely. We can put something together and send it on for circulation to the members. 

Chairman: That would be great. 

Deputy Gino Kenny: I wish to make a very brief point. I completely concur with what Mr. Power said. There were concerns over the report. There was some very unhelpful commentary in it, particularly the view that the mental health system will be overrun because of cannabis use. That is just not helpful. Some of the terminology does not help in the discourse on this issue. We probably need to have a wider debate on drug use and decriminalisation. We are all adults and want the best for our young people. Every drug, whether legal or not, will be used so we need to have a more mature conversation on drug use than the one we have been having over the years. Stigmatising and marginalising people just does not work; in fact, it is counter-productive. We want a system involving harm reduction and education. Telling people to simply say no to drugs does not work. We want a system in which the facts on every drug in society, whether it is bought on the street or in the pharmacy, are given to people. When people are given facts, without preaching to them, there are better outcomes for everybody. The current system just does not work. Again, it is a matter for a wider debate, which we will probably have in the future. 

Deputy Mark Ward: Deputy Gino Kenny is bang-on in that there is definitely a debate to be had on cannabis use, particularly among young people. I read the report during the week. I worked in my local addiction centre in Clondalkin, the Clondalkin Addiction Support Programme, for numerous years. Over the years in Clondalkin, we saw polydrug use. We saw many people who were more entrenched in addiction, basically taking whatever was available, be it crack cocaine, heroin, tablets or whatever else was on the street. I then changed jobs and moved to a part of Dublin 8 that I will not name because I do not want to stigmatise an area. Deputy Gino Kenny is correct in this regard. The service to which I moved was new. The only people coming into the service when I was there were young males between 16 and 24 and some young females, all on account of problematic cannabis use. I am referring to weed, not the hash that was available years ago when I was growing up. The young people had reached the stage of problematic drug use. I was encountering young people who had stopped engaging with schools and youth services. They had started engaging in crime because of drug debts that had accumulated. They had got into trouble with the Garda. Among these young people, I basically encountered all the things we would have seen in the 1980s and early 1990s when the heroin epidemic hit our area. It was an eye-opener for me because I was not expecting it, even though I came from an area that saw a lot of drug use over the years. The young people in question comprised a very small cohort of cannabis users who had got to the problematic stage. Interventions need to be made. Much of it is about education, not about preaching, as Deputy Gino Kenny was saying. It is about education to prevent people from moving from the recreational stage to the problematic stage. That is where the intervention is required. 

We worked on a reduce-the-use programme. If we tell a group of young people that they should stop smoking cannabis tomorrow, we might as well be talking to a wall because we would not get any response. We should work on measures that enable the youths to reduce their cannabis use and, in tandem, bring some benefits back into their lives, even if these benefits just involve going for a walk, going to the gym or going back into education. The youths I was dealing with were replacing activity resulting in adverse effects with activity that would be beneficial. 

A dedicated treatment centre was set up in the Naul to address cannabis use among young people. It was inundated with people trying to access it. There is a cohort who can get caught up in cannabis addiction. I have done a lot of research on this and could send some material on, including on the fact that the brain is not fully developed until the age of 25, as Mr. Power mentioned. A lot of research was carried out indicating that sustained overuse of cannabis at a very young age can bring out underlying psychosis that might not otherwise present. It also indicates that where it does present, it is not as acute if cannabis is not a factor. Those are some of the issues we face. 

A debate needs to be had. I have seen at first hand what is happening and I have worked in this area. I have seen the problematic side of drug use but I have also seen, and have known, many young people whose recreational use would not reach the problematic stage. If we can work in this space in regard to harm reduction, it would help. I thank Deputy Gino Kenny for raising the matter. 

Mr. Ian Power: To respond to both Deputies' points, I really welcome the college highlighting the issue. As Deputy Gino Kenny said, I do not believe young people are aware of some of the devastating effects cannabis can have on those predisposed to psychosis or other conditions, as mentioned by Deputy Ward. Young people should have the facts but we feel the approach is not productive. We need to have a more mature conversation with young people about this. 

Chairman: It is definitely a subject on which we need to have a deeper discussion.

[For the full debate on the Oireachtas website, click this link]